Friday, March 30, 2012

‎2012 Division Spring Annual Meeting

Tomorrow at the end of Divisionals there will be voting on amendments to the bylaws of the NC Division.

 One of the things to be voted on will be an amendment to exclude fencing clubs that are not USA Fencing members from being listed on the NC Division web site. There is a provision for college clubs, but I do not consider it to be understanding of most of the college clubs in the state. The NC Division will spring for the 40 dollars needed for a basic uninsured membership for these clubs, if they hold a tournament. However, it does not take into account the club would need 10 USA memberships. 10 college kids in a club coming up with 60 bucks is a lot to ask when they are struggling just to have basic equipment. Ever been to ASU; Wake; UNC Asheville; UNCG clubs? Or what about a unique program like NCFDP? Great program and has been good for fencers all over the state, but is it a college club? Besides college clubs, recreational clubs would not be listed either. This doesn’t sound like it promotes fencing in the state to me.


Ron Miller said...


You are right that excluding anyone from the NC Divisional Website is self defeating. We are all in the business of trying to help fencing grow and develop in this division. Membership and insurance are important issues, but should, in my opinion, not be used to exclude or punish schools or smaller clubs. NCFDP usually joins for insurance reasons and to support USA Fencing, but with the higher club rates for insurance even a club the size of ours cannot easily afford to join in a timely fashion. We need to find another way to solve this issue without exclusion which only hurts those need help or serve the division in other ways. I will try to be at the meeting to speak to this issue.


cobalt said...

This might have to do with the insurance changes that are coming down the pipe from the national office. Their tends to be a push for drawing the line regarding what membership means, and what not being a member means. Also, there tend to be more than a few that want to exploit the gray area for less than honest purposes.

Honestly, the upcoming insurance changes are more of a concern for many than a website link. We might all be getting into knickers sales soon. Not totally unexpected though. Kinda wish it was a year later though.

The Gray Epee said...

I am very aware of the insurance changes, but that is not what this is about.

Most college clubs need help. They don't need to be swept under the rug. If most of your club is 10 to 12 years old, I don't see the point of having them be USA Fencing members. There isn't enough events for them in the state to make it worth while. Still, there are ways to work around the membership requirments there....but not so much for college clubs.

The Gray Epee said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
David Minton said...


I appreciate your reviewing the proposed bylaws changes. As noted, these are proposed changes, an open to discussion, and ultimately a vote by the members. There will be ample opportunity on Saturday to discuss this before a vote.

The one in question came at my suggestion. I noticed in the bylaws that we define who an individual member of Division is, but not a member club. If I post a sign on my garage, am I a member club, with the same rights and privileges as NCFDP, or MSFC, or your club? I don't think so, but that is my subjective opinion. I wanted to add an objective criteria. At $40/year, I thought a Basic USA Fencing Club Membership would be a good criteria. With a ten member minimum requirement, I now see this is not reasonable, as it is a barrier to new and small clubs.

As far as website listings, I would like to only list active clubs with current contact information. I also don't want to burden a Division volunteer with tracking down this information. I send Division notices to the email addresses listing on the Division website to club leaders, and a number of them bounce each time. For someone looking to join a club, this doesn't reflect positively on the Division.

Also, this was actually intended to help college/university clubs, since it cover the cost of their club membership if they provided contact information to the Division. The Division can't help these clubs if it doesn't know how to contact them.

Further, while I may be looking for problems that don't exist, I have a fear of a club like this one showing up in North Carolina: and having a mechanism in place to exclude them.

-David Minton

cobalt said...

Cause obviously "saber is arguably the simplest form to learn with the least number of moves to train." 0_0 *facepalm*

Thanks David. I can't unsee that now.